Against All Odds: Sean Swarner's Inspirational Path From Illness to Everest

00:06
Hello and welcome to the VK podcast. I'm Ryan Alford, your cohost joined my friend and cohost Chris Hansen, who's in Orlando today. We're joined today by inspirational speaker, author, adventurer, Sean Swarmer. What's up, Sean? Hey, how's it going, man? I've enjoyed the conversation we had before we hit record too and I'm sure it's gonna keep going. Exactly, it's always good. I think we know it's gonna be a good show when...

00:33
It feels like we're having natural conversation and flow before we even get started. Oh, hit record, hit record. Literally. It's like, bro, we should have been recording the first 10 minutes. Exactly. Uh, so we're in Colorado today. Sean's all right. Yeah. Just South of Denver, Colorado this weekend, heading to Puerto Rico where my wife was born and raised and again, we're expecting a bunch of, uh, I don't know about 10 inches of snow and the only white stuff I want to see right now is sand. Are you a skier?

01:03
You know, I used to be, but when my wife moved from Puerto Rico here, I don't know if you've ever seen a Puerto Rican on skis before, but there's a reason they love the beach, not the mountains. I feel like there's a joke in there somewhere. I have seen many Puerto Ricans on skis. I used to go skiing with my buddies growing up. It was definitely a different... Not their most natural habitat.

01:32
No, no, not at all. But I used to, when I lived up in Brackenridge in Summit County here in Colorado, there was one year I put in, I think it was 130 days of skiing that season. Wow. That's, that's getting it. I, but let's see, let's see it best both worlds. You get the, you know, Colorado, you get the beauty of the snow, I guess. I'm sure you do. You may not think it's beautiful, but most people do all that snow blowing, but, uh, but then go into the warmth of Puerto Rico, right? You got both ends of the spectrum.

02:02
Absolutely. Funny thing is my wife's also afraid of fish. Wow. That's a surprise. Well, before meeting me, her idea of stepping out of her comfort zone was going to the beach and forgetting a bottle of sunscreen. There you go. Well, we do it, correct? Yeah, no kidding. And I know because Sean is a testament to human resilience and determination. I know you've had.

02:30
two different terminal cancer in your teens and have gone on to do things that many of us could only imagine. So Sean, I'd love for us to set the table for our audience and, um, you know, delve into who exactly is Sean's former. Absolutely, man. I can say that in one breath. I'm actually, well, I've been voted one of the top eight most inspirational people in history. And I'm also the only person in the world in history to climb on ever.

02:58
highest mountain on every continent. I've skied to both the North and South Poles and I've completed the world championship Ironman Triathlon in Hawaii. After surviving two terminal cancers, like you mentioned, a prognosis of three months to live, 14 days to live, I was read my last rights, I was in a medically induced coma for a year of my life, and I only have one functioning lung. I mean, Sean, you're so lazy. Why don't you do something motivational? Good grief.

03:24
We can, I mean, you know, I'll just go, I'll go in the corner. I'm going to quietly, you know, if my head seems like it's pointed down the rest of this episode, yeah, I have not done enough with my life, Sean. But few of us have few of us are one of the most inspirational people in the world. But I mean, I don't know, you know, we could probably talk for three hours about that journey, Sean. Sometimes people say things and it's like, it's a good 20 minutes. But then.

03:52
Mike shit, shit. I don't think we could do justice to how ridiculous all those facts are, but we're going to ask you to do it for us anyway. I mean, talk, you know, you know, your story and your journey and, and this format, so let's, let's talk about what you think could, could really bring value and substance to that. Yeah, absolutely. You know, it's, it's interesting whenever, whenever I'm traveling or whenever I'm giving a keynote talk.

04:21
And people ask, well, what do you do? And I'm like, well, that's like opening a bag of cats. I don't know. There's so many different things I do. But then I tell them what I just mentioned and they have one of two responses. And it's either what you did. You're like, I'm going to hang my head low. I haven't done anything with my life or you've enspowered me. You've, you've inspired me to go on because not everyone's going to climb Everest, but we all have an Everest to climb. Yeah. And I think one of the biggest things that, that people were

04:50
where people feel the most, I think, is comparing themselves to others as opposed to who they were and where they were yesterday. There's an unlock. There's a ding ding highlight clip right there. I mean, I think that's for all of us, you know, because every journey is different. And I mean, I mean this in the best way possible. It's not necessarily anyone else's fault that they didn't have to survive cancer twice.

05:18
They were blessed and lucky enough. I'm glad I didn't have to, but we all have things we have to overcome in places we've got to go from A to B or A to D. And that journey can be different, but we've got to just measure it by what we can control, right? Absolutely. And I think it goes back to doing what you want to do based on what you value most. And so many people

05:47
don't take time out of their, not even their day or their week or their months, but out of their lives to understand and utilize their own personal core values. Because we all have obstacles that get in our way. Like you said, we all have mountains, but if you understand what your personal core values are, the reason for doing what you are, that is always gonna give you enough drive and motivation and inspiration and empowerment.

06:14
to blast past whatever obstacles are in your way, because those mean more to you than anything that could potentially slow you down. What do you think the unlock is for people to understand? This is gonna sound crazy, but I was hearing you saying that and I'm nodding. But then I'm like, how do people understand the run, do people understand the run court? Like, how do they unlock that? Like they have, let's just assume we're talking about the average.

06:42
normal good person. It's not a serial crime spree expert or something that has just the average desire to be a good person and to do the right things. With that said, I'm not sure people even know. They know what they believe, I think, but sometimes they don't know exactly what their core values are. They have to kind of discover what they want to do and how they want to do it.

07:12
It comes back to a question that I've always asked myself. What it boggles my mind, how so many people are more concerned about what others think of them than what they think of themselves. And in that just, I don't get that. Like, why am I going to make decisions based on what somebody else who's following me on social media, they get upset for me doing something or posting something? Well, I'm doing it because that's what I value.

07:41
Yeah. You know, and also when people get upset about that, one of the biggest things that, that I hope people understand is what I say is about me. What you hear is about you. So how do you interpret what I say or how I interpret what you say might be completely different than the real meaning behind it. 100%. That's powerful. But, but going back to the, the personal core values, if

08:09
What if you could discover your innermost motivators so that you could accomplish your outermost goals and dreams?

08:18
The way to do that is by figuring out what your personal core values are. And the way to figure out what your personal core values are is to take time out and write down what you value. It could be family, it could be security, it could be freedom, it could be love, it could be appreciation. I couldn't figure it out on my own, so I actually, I created my own core values assessment. I did it myself. And it is, Sean, nature or nurture for you?

08:48
Were you? Were you? Were you? Yeah, I like what you did there. Hey, this is I. I'm like interviewing myself here. Except the part about cancer and climbing Everest and being one of the top most inspirational people ever. This may be how your brain works. The but like just in aiding you to be able to battle those, the cancer to turn it into what you've turned it into. I mean, was that just.

09:18
Are you born to do that? Well, I think going, going back, I don't, I don't know. I have no idea. You know, but I, but I think if, if you kind of look at how all human beings are when they start making choices in their lives, like our lives in general, it's kind of like a tree and not like a Palm tree, but one that has a bunch of different branches. So when you're younger, you know, that's the trunk, your parents are making decisions for you, you know, eat this, do that, go here, sleep now.

09:47
wake up then, but then you get to a point where you're a little bit older, you start making decisions on your own. Those branches go out. So going back, if I wouldn't have had these cancers, I have no idea where I'd be. But I also think that I was, I don't want to say groomed, but I was prepped in the right way to go through these. Not that my parents knew I was going to get cancer, but I think that it goes back to when I was five or six years old.

10:15
And I'll swim and say the 25 meter breaststroke, I touched the wall, they pull me out of the water and they would ask me one of two questions and it was either, well, it was both, did you have fun and did you do your best? Not why didn't you beat Jimmy? Why didn't you beat Chris? Why didn't you beat Ryan? Why'd you let them beat you? It was like, you know, did you do your best? And that goes back to improving myself a little bit today than I did yesterday. But that also instilled in me the idea and concept of

10:43
really enjoying what I was doing. You know, because it was never about touching the wall and hopping out in first place, it was touching the wall and enjoying the breaststroke along the way. So I had the seed planted from my parents to have the right mentality going into the cancers. But during the cancers, I think that also shaped me as well. And so I think to answer your question, like I said before, in a very precise and concise way, yes.

11:13
It was both, but I, you know, you said something that really unlocked leaks, meet something for me and it's, it's simple. And I don't know. Like sometimes I have these conversations and my brain goes in like different directions, but then I think about some of the challenges we have. And like you said, people thinking too much about what other people think instead of themselves and like certain like.

11:37
But you really nailed it. Like as you grow up and what I see some of the challenges with people, you know, you may have been groomed, but at a certain point before, during, after the cancers, you had choices to make. How you were going to, how are you going to turn, you know, not only just survive it, I mean, that alone, the survival instincts, but then, and I don't know if those are choices or I guess they are choices, but it's, uh, just.

12:03
Fortitude and and what I one of my favorite Attributes which is grit. I think it's an under it's like my favorite attribute in someone But I do think that's the problem today is like choices. We all have choices we we empower so many other things But you're in control to make the choices And at some point you chose

12:32
to be inspirational and to do things that no others have ever done. You know, I love that because I couldn't control the fact that I had cancer. It was what it was. And I could be asking myself a thousand times over, why me, why me, why me? I may never get the answer. You know, anybody going through something in their lives or maybe they're who knows, let's say the credit card was compromised. Well, why'd that happen? Well, you may never know.

13:00
Maybe because some schmuck just wanted to see if he could hack into your account, who knows. But the choice, the thing behind it is that because I couldn't control the fact that I had cancer, I had full control over how I reacted to it. And that's the case in any situation. And I think that goes back to when I was 13 with my first cancer, about three or four months into treatment.

13:26
You know, my hair fell out. I was about 60 pounds overweight and I was on the shower floor on my hands and knees sobbing. You know, I had nothing left. I remember looking in the mirror before I went into the shower and I was this hideous beast in my eyes. There was nothing left of who this athlete was. And I remember the water was filling up in the, in the shower because my hair was clogging the drain and I literally had two choices. I could fight for my life or give up and die.

13:56
And the latter is not an option. But also in that same moment, I realized I didn't want to focus on not dying. I wanted to focus on living. Same concept, different perspective. And I think so many people out there get caught up in the avoidance of what they don't want, as opposed to going after what they do want. For example, the game last night, do you think the Detroit Lions went into the game thinking, oh, don't lose? Or anybody who goes into business thinking, don't lose money?

14:26
But so many people have that negative mentality and they don't even realize they're doing it to themselves. Scarcity. Yeah. And, and, and we're very self-limiting as a, as humanity. I don't know why, but we are in general.

14:45
Is Sean, talk to me about. Climbing Mount Everest, where did that where did you know? Why ever? Yeah, where did you know that? And we're short cutting the fact that you clearly got over the cancer battle that kicked its ass and said, all right, I got one lung, but I'm still I got one long one life and one legacy. So we're going to go.

15:10
I'm writing your book, your newest books on in my mind. The, uh, why Everest? You know, it's, it's interesting because after you've, you've been read your last rights and you have 14 days to live and you literally fall asleep every night for a year and a half terrified to close your eyes because you don't know if they're going to open the next morning, you look at life a little bit differently.

15:39
So every time your eyes open, you're like, oh my God, this is the best day ever, no matter what happens. I'm gonna choose, it's my choice to make it that way. So long story short, I was actually living in Jacksonville, Florida, getting my master's in my doctorate in psycho-oncology. I wanted to be a psychologist for cancer patients when I came up with this idea of giving back and utilizing the highest mountain in the world ever to be a platform to give people touched by cancer hope. And it's evolved into just more than cancer patients.

16:08
in survivors. But when I first came up with the idea, you know, like anything, I started doing some research and I don't, do you guys know what the highest point in Florida is? Is it a, don't tell me it's like a trash dump. No, no. I was going to say think manmade. It's, it's actually the top of the four seasons hotel in Miami. I was going to say a roller coaster or something in Orlando. Dis-do-or-ho.

16:38
How many stories is that? I think it's 780 feet or something like that. I've been there great hotel. I mean super nice hotel. Yeah, the high natural point is Britain Hill at 345 feet. Wapping 340 feet. Yeah. So anyhow, I moved from Jacksonville out to Colorado started climbing pretty much everything in sight.

17:06
You know, realizing that if I was going to train and do something no one's ever done before, I'm going to have to train like no one's ever trained before. So you, you didn't have a background in climbing or hiking at all prior to none. So he went from zero to I'm going to go do the super bowl of mountains. Yeah. Essentially I went, yeah, I went from like Pee Wee flag football to the super bowl in nine months.

17:34
Yeah, no kidding. Kahane is my brother. I, when I first moved out here, I literally had a payphone bank in the library as my office, you know, trying to get sponsorship to climb the mountain. And I was homeless for two months camping out of the back of my Honda Civic.

17:54
that also amazing part of your journey. And I think.

18:01
in a way, an entrepreneurial lesson, because you were building a business in a way, right? I mean, your organization, your nonprofit. So how did you stay motivated by your homeless? You know, it's interesting. I got the... I had no choice. I essentially pulled up on the beach and burned my boats, you know, and I had to go storm the castle.

18:30
I gave myself jokingly, you know, if plan A doesn't work out, there are 25 other letters in the alphabet, but I gave myself just one option. Like this, this was it. I was going to make it happen. And I remember instead of going after the corporations. So for example, you know, a lot of people go after say the North Face or Patagonia or Marmot. I was thinking, okay, well, how can I do things differently? And I started approaching the manufacturing companies. I went after Gore-Tex.

18:58
got Gore-Tex as a sponsor and because I got Gore-Tex like, okay, well, who would you like? As opposed to going to those individual companies saying, Hey, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm climbing Mount Everest in eight months and I have one lung. I've survived two cancer. Hello. I went, I went after the company who made the materials for the distribution of the outdoor companies. Smart.

19:26
Then they made the connections from there. Exactly. So instead of trying to work myself up, work my way up the chain, just like climbing, I started off with the big boys. I went off, went after the manufacturing companies just like I went after Everest first.

19:43
is I assume, how's your health today? Health is great. No one's ever had Hodgkin's lymphoma and Ascon sarcoma before. So I have to go in once a year for a checkup. So in my eyes, I'll just be constantly in remission for the rest of my life. Have you been in remission since you were a teenager? Like no recurrences? No recurrences, no scares, no nothing. Is that rare? Yeah.

20:10
Yeah, most people who get diagnosed with Ascansarcoma or it's a branch of Ewing sarcoma to get technical, the prognosis rate is roughly 6%. Right, so most people don't live past five years.

20:26
What do the doctors say now? Like, is it year by year? Is it, I know you're a walking anomaly, but, um, I think I'm a living, breathing, walking miracle hands down. But is it, are you always at, I guess that jeopardy, I mean, of, of the potential because anyone can get cancer at any time or has your, does your past still play a role in the future?

20:55
I would say both in a way because I mean, I can't donate any organs because I had a blood cancer. I can't give blood, you know, I can't donate blood, which I wish I could. Because when I come back from these high altitude mountains, I have extra in my body, like just take it, you know, help somebody out. But because no one's ever had these, they don't know. It's just year by year. In my mind, I'm like, I'm good. You know, and it's what's the point of sitting around waiting and wondering and

21:25
Of course. It was more like just getting to like peace of mind is like, you know, but I guess it's all different once you've gone through what you have, like you, you, you start to live in the day instead of living in the life. And it's also amazing what the human body and mind are capable of doing when it has to, when it's in that situation. I know earlier we mentioned that, you know, it was my choice to continue fighting, but

21:54
In all honesty, yes, it was a choice, but I'm not going to give up and die.

22:01
So it really wasn't a choice. I wanted to push forward. Yeah. But let, let's not continue. Let's not discount the fact that there's a lot of people that have survived cancer. There's not a lot of people that survived cancer had one long and client Mount Everest. So I don't want to diminish the accomplishment on any level of how ridiculous that was and the other, you know, triathlons and.

22:30
You know, all that other shit that Chris and I haven't done is too healthy. American, uh, you know, males with no major health issues. You know, what, what are some big, big things that you want to accomplish in your lives? Oh, our lives, me? Yeah. Mine. Yeah. Look, I have four kids and you know, happily married, four boys. And a lot of my accomplishments are tied to warning my kids to be

23:00
brought up right and teaching and growing them. And I don't know, it changes when you have children. It doesn't mean I don't have aspirations. I've worked out five days a week since I was 22 days, 22, 22 days, 22 years old. So like, I have this natural drive to kind of stay at a certain level of condition and things. And I put certain challenges in front of me, but I'm very self-motivated.

23:27
I just don't know that I've just never gone. I need to go do an iron man. You know, I don't know. Well, you know, it's, it's, it's interesting because marriage is more difficult than climbing Everest sometimes. Yes.

23:40
I haven't climbed Everest, but I think it probably is probably right. As an outsider, I would agree with that statement. Not your marriage, but most marriages in particular. Yeah, yeah, because, you know, here's why. So here's the unlock for everyone. When you're when you're climbing Everest, the battles with you and Everest, and it's really a you thing. Only you. You control it.

24:09
If you get your shit together and you create your goals and your tasks and everything, it's only you and those in that list with Everest. With marriage, there's two people involved. So it's twice the complex of, you know, working together as a team, making all that stuff come together. And when anyone else other than you is involved, you don't control everything. That's the difference.

24:37
I would completely agree with that because on the mountain, you also have to remember that it's never you versus the mountain. You never conquer the mountain. You never conquer mother nature. If it's you versus her, she's going to beat you down every single time. I don't care who you are. Mother nature. You versus you, right? Yeah. But you learn to conquer yourself. You learn to conquer your inner demons. You learn to conquer that internal dialogue. But going back to reaching the summit and everything, what does it mean to you?

25:06
You know, why do people get married? Why do they have gold? Because as soon as you reach the summit of your peak, there are going to be other mountains to climb. When you cross that finish line, they're going to be other races to run. Why are you doing it? And I think for a lot of people, you know, they always think that people that say this don't understand what it's like to maybe to be them. And that's the journey is everything. But, but I do think for motivated people or just people in general, it's

25:36
getting somewhere, the destination is never as, I don't know, interesting as the journey. Or, and it's like, we always need the next journey. And Sean, I mean, I don't, just reading about you and talking with you, there's gotta always be another journey in your mind, I would think, to keep you motivated. Absolutely. And if it's, every time somebody says, you know, it's not about the destination, it's about the journey.

26:03
Jokingly, I think to myself, yeah, tell that to somebody who's been circling Chicago O'Hara airport because of weather for the past three hours. Yeah, I've been there. I've done that. I've got that t-shirt. Hey, but it was that journey that taught me patience. It's not what it was doing to me. It was for me.

26:31
Fuck you. What are you talking about? Just land the damn plane. Thank you God for teaching me this lesson patience. No, but, but also it, it's interesting too, because you know, a lot of people don't realize how long it takes to climb ever. So I got the base camp April 8th. I summited May 16th. Right. So that's what I'm almost a month and a half.

27:00
I only spent 30 minutes on top. So like you're right, going back to the journey, meaning more than the destination, I learned so much more about myself in that month and a half than I did actually at the goal on the top. So what's next is after I've learned that there are always gonna be other mountains to climb, other goals, other pinnacles to reach, other whatever I have in my life,

27:30
potentially Everest again next year without supplemental oxygen. Hmm. And I'd love to do that, but I'm also utilizing now everything that I've done and accomplished to help other people with, I actually, I'll give it to you guys. I recently developed a three week mental wellness challenge to help walk people through their own personal core values.

27:52
It's really interesting. That is interesting. Good. Take us down that path a little bit more, Sean. What, what all's evolved with that? Sure. It's, it's called the big hill challenge and, uh, it initially started off as a way to help cancer patients transition into survivorship because for example, I mentioned night after night, I'd be terrified to close my eyes, right? Cause I didn't know if I was going to wake up the next day, going through the journey of.

28:21
being a cancer patient, you know, I had in most people, they have the nonprofits there, they have the safety nets, they have the team. You know, I've never summited at any significant peak by myself. The mountains, the challenges, the cancer, whatever. But after I was placed in remission, now my family, the doctors, the nurses, the nonprofits, all those people were like, hell yeah, this is fantastic, Sean's in remission.

28:47
my first thought wasn't, oh, sweet, I get to go start my life. It was, well, the hell do I do now? Like, where do I even begin? But the hospital system just says, okay, now go live your life. Like, well, how? So I kind of put that together initially to help people transition instead of climbing down to that valley crossing the river and climbing back up, you know, helps them build a bridge. And now it's for anyone who's gone going through any transitional period in their lives.

29:17
It helps them utilize their own personal core values, as opposed to some guru saying, this is what you need to do to be successful. This is what you need to do to be happy. You know, it all depends on what you value. And just like climbing Kilimanjaro, I've, I've been up the highest mountain in Africa now, 20, 24 times. The average success rate is 48%. My groups are at 99% success rate. Right. Double the mountains.

29:43
And I think it's because I lead from behind. I encourage people and empower them to go out and explore. That's where this big hill challenge comes in. It helps people utilize their own personal core values and I'm there guiding them from behind, encouraging them to go and do it themselves.

30:02
I think you nailed, I mean, thinking about all the voices that are out there with social media and stuff, and they're saying the right things, and I mean, a lot of it's coming from a good place. But I think you're right. If you haven't figured out what matters to you, then you don't know how to apply that in the right way. Absolutely. That's usual. That's your why. Yeah.

30:33
I was gonna say, and then you get caught up going after what other people want, what their goals are. You start adopting their personal core values and you lose yourself in the process. And you're not happy and you don't know why exactly. Then you start blaming other people for your own happiness. Well, it's, it's not their fault. You decided to go after what they value. I feel like that's happening even more frequently with the social media. It's like we're getting presented these

31:01
pictures of avatars, right? Where it's like, dude, life is way bigger than, and I, I talk about it usually from a business perspective, where I'm telling these young guys I talked to, there's a lot of ways to make money outside of TikTok and algorithm, whatever the algorithm, right? Amazon, FPA, there's a ton of ways if you branch out and explore, try new stuff, you know, try new things.

31:32
I definitely never thought I'd be doing this with Ryan, if you asked me three years ago, but I enjoy it. Yeah, it's very similar to climbing Everest or any mountain. There are numerous right ways, numerous paths, numerous routes to reach the summit. Pick the one that works best for your skill set. Pick the route to success, however you wanna define it, that...

31:59
that fits best with your personal core values. You know, if you think of core values kind of like the bumpers and bumper bowling, you know, those things come up, you toss the ball down, core values kind of keep you in the lane. The guard rails. Exactly. You're right.

32:23
Cancer climber association. And that's your foundation. Is that, um, so it keeps you climbing. I bet it was literally and figuratively. Absolutely. So go back to going back to Kilimanjaro. We, we pay for a survivor's trip up Kilimanjaro every year and anyone can go. You know, we're going again this July.

32:48
Um, but we cover the costs of a cancer survivor every year. A couple of years ago, we covered two or three cancer survivors. Then it's the responsibility of that survivor to raise funds for next year's survivor. So it's really cool seeing those two survivors connect and talk about their journeys, you know, their cancer journeys and the mountain journey. Super cool. Paying it forward. Absolutely, man. And I think it's, it's.

33:16
It's really cool when you connect those like-minded individuals who have a similar story who are encouraging each other. Yeah, paying it forward. Yeah.

33:31
So how many people are on these groups when you take a group up Kilimanjaro? How many people are you guiding? I've taken as many as, I think it was 31 and as few as four, because we went during COVID and I'll never do 30 again. It's like herding cats on the mountain. It was just, it was insane. But the guides, I've used the same local guides and porters and...

34:01
servers and cooks for the past 23 trips up the mountain. And during COVID, as you can imagine over there, they rely 99.9% on tourism. So when they weren't getting anybody for two years, like I have to go support my brothers. You know, they adopted me into the Chugga tribe. I'm like the only white member of the Chugga tribe. And they gave me a Swahili name, which is Mizungu Kicha, which translates literally to

34:30
crazy white man. They adopted me into their tribe. And we went there during COVID took four people up and then came off the mountain took them on a safari then went up again for people. But you see the painting behind me. One of my friends painted that and he actually employs a number of painters and carvers and artists who do these little trinkets and souvenirs. So he

35:00
paintings and I put them online, Sean Swarner.com. We sell them and give them the money now. That's awesome. Crazy white man. I wonder where that came from. Did they know your story? Yeah, they do. They know the story really well. And like I said, one guy, his name's Taylor Phil, he's the guy who adopted me into his family and into his tribe is amazing. They sacrificed a goat.

35:29
and they gave us all different portions of the goat. So if you ever get a chance to try goat lung, I would highly suggest passing. Yeah. I wouldn't need much convincing to pass on that. But speaking of lungs, do you have two functioning lungs now? I only have one. So I have two lungs, but there's so much scar tissue, am I right one? That there's really no oxygen transfer.

35:59
I'm sure that's just became your new normal then. And now it's just, I guess, normal. I mean, do you ever feel like you don't get enough oxygen? Or is it? Yeah, you know, when you're at like 19,000 feet sucking wind, sometimes I think to myself, God, this would be so much easier if I had two lungs. Yeah, man. Yeah.

36:24
That's how I would be with two lungs. I wish I had four. What else is on the agenda for Sean Swarmer?

36:39
I recently got a book out. I'll send you guys after we're done, send me your addresses. I'll send you a book and I'll give you a code to get into the Big Hill Challenge. Kill a Majora twice again this year. Potentially, like I said, Everest next year. And my ultimate goal, I think, would be to have a Hollywood feature film. You know, just to share the summary, just to get it out there to more people because now more than ever.

37:07
People need a story of hope. People need a story of resilience and grit. They need to believe something's possible and bigger. Surely you've had those discussions. I mean, there's, there's been movies about less accomplishments than this. I mean, right. So have you had those discussions? I have not because in this world, as you know, it's not what you know, it's who you know. Yeah. So I'm slowly making those.

37:36
those introductions. And if you look at the past, say 15 years, it's been a team of myself and my manager. You know, I got two book deals, I have a film on Amazon about my trip to the North Pole is called the true north Sean's Warner story. Beautiful footage. A number of keynote presentations sponsorship, etc. I've done that all myself, but I hit that glass ceiling. Like I need people in the right place.

38:02
So I've teamed up with a handful of people and three very, very good ones. His names is Braxton, Andy and Dylan. You know, they're the ones who are really supporting what I'm doing now and we're making a really, really heavy push this year that I think the world's gonna be surprised and they're gonna say, wow, this is the greatest story I've never heard. Is in the Amazons or the, I think I heard Amazon, the feature that you mentioned on the North Pole, that's not like the full story.

38:29
It's a 53 minute documentary, I think. And it was Emmy nominated, so it doesn't go too deep. And it was more of a documentary than a film. I would love to see a two hour long feature film or even maybe a series on Netflix that covers each one of the mountains and flashes back to something I learned while I was going through the treatment. Yeah, were there any life threatening moments on or?

38:53
As weird as that sounds like other than other than being a cancer. Yeah, sure. But like, were there scares? Or there's good with our Hollywood drama on these trips beyond the fact that you had one long and you could fall over at any second. Yeah, aside from the whole story now. I guess I mean, like harrowing on the journey, like we weren't sure if Sean was going to make it, you know, you know, like.

39:23
There was my first attempt up Denali, which is the highest mountain in North America, in Alaska. I was on the crux of the climb. It's like an 800 meter bulletproof glacier, right? And I remember I was testing out these new crampons, which are the metal spikes you attach to the bottom of your boots. And I was chipping my way up. I was roped up to a climbing partner. So I had 50 feet of rope between him and I, and it was almost all the way out to 50 feet.

39:51
I slipped and I started rocketing down the glacier, right? And because there were 50 feet of rope between him and I, I fell 50 feet to him and then 50 feet below him. So I fell essentially a hundred feet. And what was crazy was depending on the perspective you have, time goes by differently. So for me, I remember sliding on my butt and literally thinking, well, this isn't good.

40:15
Like I should probably roll over and try to stop. So roll it over. At that point, you know, I started slowing down because of my eye sacs. And for my climbing partner, he's like, oh shit, and it's over. So I climbed back up to where I fell. I belayed him in. And when he got there, I was shaking. Like my adrenaline was gone. I looked at him and I was like, dude, we gotta get back down to camp. You know, I just need some, I need a timeout. And...

40:42
I'm a big believer in signs and I sat in my tent. I literally looked up and I was like, you know, give me a sign. Let me know if I should be here. Let me know if it's my time or not. And I leaned back into my tent. My hood caught my glacier glasses and snapped them in half. My first thought was, well, shit, I need those, man. Like you couldn't just like send us like a shooting star or someone else saying, hey, Sean, you going down? I need those. That was the biggest one. I almost died. But on Everest, I also suffered.

41:12
high altitude cerebral edema, which is essentially altitude induced swelling in the brain. And the only cure for it is to go down in altitude. And I remember we were at camp three. So there are four major camps on the South side. You got base camp, then you got camp one, two, three. And then from four is where you stage the summit push, right? And I was at camp three and I remember eating dinner that night. It was like dehydrated beef stew. So like the chunks of beef,

41:41
cubed carrots, the green peas and the spiral noodles, right? And I remember just chowing that down, went to sleep, woke up the next morning and I had to get it out. I just, I had to vomit it out. So I remember getting everything I had for dinner out and I could still see the peas, the carrots and the noodles and the beef. So my stomach wasn't digesting anything, which meant my body was shutting down.

42:08
because my brain wasn't telling my stomach, hey, digest this food, because it was swelling. But it turned out to be a blessing in disguise because I couldn't go down. And everybody else who's on the same schedule as us left from other expeditions. They left camp three, went up to camp four, slept there and then pushed for the summit that night. The weather got bad. They all had to turn around. I slept on oxygen at camp three when everybody else left the day later.

42:37
went up to camp four and went for the summit in this, it was like a slight breeze on the summit. So it was, like I said, it was a blessing in disguise. Hmm.

42:48
You never know. I mean, how do you, that sounds like good a movie drama to me, Sean. Let me ask you this with the brain swelling, was there any other tell besides your food digestion? My, my balance was way off. So one of the ways up there to test for it is essentially it's like a field sobriety test, you know, heel toe heel toe, right? And I couldn't put one foot in front of the other to save my life.

43:19
So I put one foot down and I tried to put the heel in front of my other toe and my leg or my foot would just end up three feet on the other side. It was like I was severely intoxicated but I had no clue. And I was sitting there trying to figure out like, why can't I walk?

43:40
Well, we're glad you made it. That alone would be scary. I've also lost a number of friends in the mountains. I on Denali or Everest, somebody went up in a storm. I stayed at camp too in my tent, literally holding up the frame of my tent for two days and two nights. Uh, just as the hurricane winds battered the, the, the tent, he went up in that same storm.

44:06
hopped in somebody else's tent. They weren't there. So when you establish the camps, you just leave your tents there so you don't have to rebuild them again. He had no food, no water for two days and two nights. And he was pretty much delirious on his way down. He mis-clipped on a guide rope and tumbled over 3000 feet to a crevasse, right? And I remember looking up there and I could see where he landed because the snow was blood red. You know, and then on Denali, two friends,

44:37
They just said, Hey, okay, well, we're shooting up for the summit from here. And I was like, the weather's not looking good. I were going up. Ever. They never came back.

44:50
Uh, yeah, these journeys are these journeys have a lot of dangers. It was going viral recently on Everest, like the videos of the bodies that are still up there and people were all kind of there's a lot of people upset about it. And then climbers were explaining, hey, like, there is no other option. This is right. And kind of like, this is the game we all signed up to play. And the climber knows this going into it and

45:18
People don't think about all that stuff. So I'm glad you talked on that because it, from what I understand, Everest has become very busy in the last 10, 20 years. I wanted to ask you on that. Have you seen from when you first went to now, it's just become packed with people looking at this like some trip to Disney world is kind of what I've gathered. Speak on that a little bit. Yeah, unfortunately, it's turned into a circus recently and it's almost like you can go to,

45:48
Travelocity.com and book a vacation to Everest, right? It's getting a little out of control. And I think it's because of two things. So many people think that they have the right to be there. Because they have the money to go up. And the Nepalese government is the one who approves the permits. And I don't know if I'm right on this or not. But I'm guessing that

46:17
10 people in the government probably get all that money anyhow. It's corrupt. So they're the ones like, yeah, add some more people, add some more people. I want to be a millionaire today. So, but going back to the people who are judging others up in the mountains for leaving the bodies there, it's like, it's like being an armchair quarterback. That person thinks they may know everything about being an altitude, but unless you've been there, you have no idea.

46:46
It's like, oh yeah, exactly. I know all about the medical industry. I play one on TV. Yeah. Right, yeah. Exactly. Sean, where can everybody learn more about everything you're doing, keep up with what you have going on, et cetera? Easiest question you've asked so far. SeanSwaner.com.

47:14
Just Sean Svander.com, just like Sean Connery and the Warner Brothers with an S. Yes. We'll have that all in our show notes. And, uh, you know, Sean, I haven't shared this with anyone else. My wife was just diagnosed with breast cancer. And so, uh, you know, not it's curable, treatable and all those things, but, uh, certainly brings a different perspective to these kinds of discussions.

47:44
Absolutely. And I'm sorry to hear that. It's like cancer has become a global epidemic. Yeah. And, you know, my best to you and your wife, because like I said before, it's not an individual journey. You're going to have to be strong for her. She's going to have to be strong for you. And it's going to be something that pulls you both through. And if there's anything you need or anything I can do to help out, please reach out. No, I appreciate that. So that's my journey right now.

48:12
Uh, you eat from, from what I understand you, you've got this and she, if she has a strong support system like you and the kids you're mentioning, not going to be easy, but it's, it's going to be doable. Nah, she good. They, they picked the wrong one. She's, she's tough. She's tougher than me. Uh, yeah. So, but we really appreciate you coming on and, um, we'll have all the links in the show notes and you really are an inspiration.

48:42
Well, I appreciate that. And I'll send you a link to the film, because one thing that we didn't talk about, and now that you mentioned your wife, on the summit of Everest, the entire time I was climbing, like I said, I had a deeper purpose behind it. And I had a flag that was about two feet by foot and a half to had names of people touched by cancer. And it was folded up in my chest pocket always close to my heart as a reminder of why I was actually doing it.

49:07
And it wasn't for me, it was for so many other people touched by cancer. So collectively we were climbing and it also became this homage for other people who have been battling. And when I reached the summit, I took that flag out, unfurled it around the top of the world and did the same thing with the seven summits of the other six continents. And same thing with the South Pole. And true north, the Shantz Warner story on Amazon, the film I mentioned, they followed the names of other people and they followed the flag to the North Pole. I won't ruin it, but.

49:36
It's kind of like the Titanic. I make it, I come back. So, you know, the both things, but I make it to the North Pole, but it's, it's very emotional now knowing when you have a deeper purpose behind not just your actions, but the actions that you're doing to help support others. So I'll, I'll share that with you and see, we'll see what you guys think. We really appreciate that. And, um, yeah, man, let's stay in touch for sure. And again, thanks so much for coming on.

50:05
Absolutely. My pleasure. Thank you guys. Hey guys, you know to find us the VK podcast dot com. That's V A Y C A Y. The only way to VK for Chris Hansen. I'm Ryan Allford. We'll see you next time on the VK podcast.